The Botman Thread - Friday Announcement!

[Cal]

This feels like it has the potential to be one of those good old fasioned transfer sagas, time for the thread.



https://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/sport ... en-botman/

Newcastle officials have agreed a £30m fee for Botman, who was keen to move to St James’ Park in January, only for Lille to reject a series of offers from the Magpies.

However, while the framework of a deal is now in place, discussions continue over how the deal will be structured.

In order to stick to their pre-agreed budget and remain within the parameters of the Premier League’s profit and sustainability regulations, Newcastle are keen to spread the payment for their majority of their planned deals this summer over as long a period as possible.

It is understood their current proposal to Lille revolves around a down-payment of around £15m, with the second half of the fee being spread over the duration of Botman’s contract. As yet, this has not been accepted by the Lille hierarchy, who have been pushing for as much of the fee as possible to be paid up front.

Talks continue, and there is growing optimism that an agreement is close. The situation is complicated by ongoing interest from AC Milan, but while the Italian champions have held talks with Lille officials and Botman’s representatives, they are yet to table a formal offer for the 22-year-old. That could change at any moment, hence Newcastle’s desire to finalise things as quickly as possible.

[Don Sholeone]

Not as excited by this as I once was, it feels like there is a lot of agent funny business going on. My biggest worry for us is players coming only for a pay day and not the project. Yes money is always going to be a big factor in all deals but I just don't like how there are so many leaks about how this and that club are coming in or interested in him. I just get the impression his reps are only seeing the money right now.

[Tsi]

To be fair to him he has come out and said he was interested in the project and that was when we were in a bad position in the lge.
So yes the pay is important but with him it looks like the project is the most important.
The funny business is all coming from the press as far as I can see.

[Oval85]

The games I've seen him he looked slow and actually reminded me of Lascelles...
Hope I'm wrong

[Tsi]

I've read that also about his pace but unlike Lascelles I've also read he's comfortable in possession with good passing ability and reads the game exceptionally well

[Don Sholeone]

It's not always about pace though, if a defender can position himself well and knows how to defend against those quicker than him then it doesn't really matter too much.

[Tsi]

I'm not buying this he wants to join Milan over us as if this was the case i'm sure Howe would have pulled the plug and moved on already.

[Remember Colo]

I'm certainly not going to judge a player for potentially needing some time to choose between us and AC Milan, a club with a great history who just won their league. Especially when the transfer window hasn't even officially opened yet and that other club has had a changing administration. If it gets to a point where it's obstructed us from moving onto other targets - that's a problem, but it feels too early for that.

[Tsi]

I agree I just don't buy into this media driven hype about a target we're linked with/pursued (since the Jan win) not wanting to come here, I doubt we'd waste ours or his time if that was the case.
We might not even be in for him

[Don Sholeone]

Could be potentially significant.

[Remember Colo]

Could be potentially significant.

Also demonstrates the potential perils of majority owners being an investment fund that don't have additional motivations for ownership (like trying to represent and promote your country...)

[bodacious benny]

Could be potentially significant.

Also demonstrates the potential perils of majority owners being an investment fund that don't have additional motivations for ownership (like trying to represent and promote your country...)

Probably not relevant to us as I doubt the owners are bothered about money coming in (other than to keep things balanced for FFP).

[Remember Colo]

Also demonstrates the potential perils of majority owners being an investment fund that don't have additional motivations for ownership (like trying to represent and promote your country...)

Probably not relevant to us as I doubt the owners are bothered about money coming in (other than to keep things balanced for FFP).

Exactly. And unlike a random faceless investment fund that actually cares about the return on their investment, PIF investments like this feel a lot less motivated by making money, but using their portfolio to spur economic development long-term.

[Don Sholeone]

You could argue PIF will act in a similar way to MA in terms of using us as an advertising vehicle they will just know that they need to maximise our advertising potential and promote our commercial growth, I expect deals with Saudi Golf and possibly one of Aramco's renewable energy ventures in the near future, this is one thing that's always overlooked with this takeover, Saudi Vision 2030 has been a huge undertaking from them well before the takeover, they have genuinely been moving towards Non-Oil based businesses if you look at their investments in recent times. This is why I've never bought into this "Sports Washing" angle, they have a ridiculously large amount to gain In terms of promoting their non Oil assets when compared to covering over human rights issues (which has never been proven to be successful). All the big investments were well underway long before us, the fact they were allowed to and relatively easily move in that direction shows the HR issues have little to no real global concern/impact on them investing and growing commercially.

What they need is their new assets front and centre on the world stage to make them financially successful, Aramco is already a regular sight in other events now and I imagine this is going to be used to promote future renewable energy projects possibly through something like ACWA who PIF now owns a considerable share of or another Aramco energy subsidiary.

[Remember Colo]

You could argue PIF will act in a similar way to MA in terms of using us as an advertising vehicle they will just know that they need to maximise our advertising potential and promote our commercial growth, I expect deals with Saudi Golf and possibly one of Aramco's renewable energy ventures in the near future, this is one thing that's always overlooked with this takeover, Saudi Vision 2030 has been a huge undertaking from them well before the takeover, they have genuinely been moving towards Non-Oil based businesses if you look at their investments in recent times. This is why I've never bought into this "Sports Washing" angle, they have a ridiculously large amount to gain In terms of promoting their non Oil assets when compared to covering over human rights issues (which has never been proven to be successful). All the big investments were well underway long before us, the fact they were allowed to and relatively easily move in that direction shows the HR issues have little to no real global concern/impact on them investing and growing commercially.

What they need is their new assets front and centre on the world stage to make them financially successful, Aramco is already a regular sight in other events now and I imagine this is going to be used to promote future renewable energy projects possibly through something like ACWA who PIF now owns a considerable share of or another Aramco energy subsidiary.

I don't disagree at all with anything there, except to say I think Sports Washing is a more encompassing term than suggested, and includes broader efforts of countries to promote their interests, economic and otherwise. So while I completely agree PIF's aims are a lot more than distracting from human rights abuses, I think investing in an English football club to advertise their portfolio of existing and new economic ventures, including renewable energies still counts as that. If anything, that's a pretty good and specific example of using sports to greenwash their brand.

Now human rights advocates may obviously fixate on the "look over here while we execute people over there" of it all, I and I think a lot of other skeptical fans have always balked at NUFC being used as a vehicle for a country marketing itself - even if it's just a bigger scale version of what Ashley was doing to promote Sports Direct (which most fans were annoyed by too). At the end of the day, they're spending money to try and make more money. whether it's to smooth over horrific domestic/international policy or advertise Aramco, it's always been about money.

[Don Sholeone]

I honestly think the majority of people just don't care about the Human Rights side of things enough for a nation to actively "Sports Wash" they have invested in many global companies without trouble they don't really need to "wash" their image in all honesty, they don't really have any obstacles, you get an amnesty letter or statement every now and again but the audience for that is very minor in the grand scheme and is pretty much preaching to the choir in terms of its reach. I think people in general are much more likely to dislike UAE, Qatar, Saudi etc for being islamic nations rather than the way they actually run things. I honestly think people over estimate how engaged others are with foreign affairs, the majority of people will only care about what directly effects them, it's kinda why in the UK voting has gone the way it has over the last 10 years.

[bodacious benny]

As westerners I think we generally overestimate how much of a s*** anyone in the Middle East cares about what we in the west think of their way of life tbh.

[Remember Colo]

I honestly think the majority of people just don't care about the Human Rights side of things enough for a nation to actively "Sports Wash" they have invested in many global companies without trouble they don't really need to "wash" their image in all honesty, they don't really have any obstacles, you get an amnesty letter or statement every now and again but the audience for that is very minor in the grand scheme and is pretty much preaching to the choir in terms of its reach. I think people in general are much more likely to dislike UAE, Qatar, Saudi etc for being islamic nations rather than the way they actually run things. I honestly think people over estimate how engaged others are with foreign affairs, the majority of people will only care about what directly effects them, it's kinda why in the UK voting has gone the way it has over the last 10 years.

At the end of the day, they want people to invest in their companies, countries and companies to do business deals, and people to travel there - and they're investing in and aligning themselves with beloved institutions (football clubs, Formula 1, etc.) to increase their profile, make money, and establish themselves as a financially and subsequently politically powerful country for generations to come.

Completely agree that anyone thinking it's all about papering over some assassination headlines is selling it short. Sports are just a small part of a big plan to further legitimize themselves within the developed world, and keep the money rolling in when inevitably everyone relies less on their oil.

[Don Sholeone]

I honestly think the majority of people just don't care about the Human Rights side of things enough for a nation to actively "Sports Wash" they have invested in many global companies without trouble they don't really need to "wash" their image in all honesty, they don't really have any obstacles, you get an amnesty letter or statement every now and again but the audience for that is very minor in the grand scheme and is pretty much preaching to the choir in terms of its reach. I think people in general are much more likely to dislike UAE, Qatar, Saudi etc for being islamic nations rather than the way they actually run things. I honestly think people over estimate how engaged others are with foreign affairs, the majority of people will only care about what directly effects them, it's kinda why in the UK voting has gone the way it has over the last 10 years.

At the end of the day, they want people to invest in their companies, countries and companies to do business deals, and people to travel there - and they're investing in and aligning themselves with beloved institutions (football clubs, Formula 1, etc.) to increase their profile, make money, and establish themselves as a financially and subsequently politically powerful country for generations to come.

Completely agree that anyone thinking it's all about papering over some assassination headlines is selling it short. Sports are just a small part of a big plan to further legitimize themselves within the developed world, and keep the money rolling in when inevitably everyone relies less on their oil.

I'd say tourism is probably the only area of business that image improvement would actually make any real sense, but also on the flip side you have to genuinely clean up your act if you are expecting to have a thriving tourism sector.

[bodacious benny]

Well Noel Whelan thinks Bailly would be a good alternative to Botman:

https://www.footballinsider247.com/newc ... st-pundit/