RAFA Future

Rafa's Future

He Stays getting on with job rejects any other job offers.
21
57%
Leaves first chance he gets.
15
41%
Ashley sells and Rafa stays
1
3%
 
Total votes: 37

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Re: RAFA Future

Post by Colly » Fri Sep 01, 2017 9:13 pm

TJR wrote:This excellent yet depressing article sums up the situation.

As long as Ashley is in charge things will never change and we won't be successful.

[tweet][/tweet]
How have they worked out that spending amount at the bottom? £13.5m? Murphy was £12m on his own.

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Re: RAFA Future

Post by Double Agent Bruce a.k.a DAB » Fri Sep 01, 2017 9:28 pm

Don't know about that. Never was at the locker room before the games.

I never read some of his former players to say something like that. But if you think like that because his calmness and pragmatic approach at the technical area... I have absolute no problem with that. Especially after pardew's exotic penalties.

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Re: RAFA Future

Post by TJR » Fri Sep 01, 2017 9:46 pm

Decent effort from the Chronicle tomorrow.

[tweet][/tweet]

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Re: RAFA Future

Post by Mifune » Fri Sep 01, 2017 9:46 pm

overseasTOON wrote:
Mifune wrote:
This was the second transfer window in a row that he has felt he hasn't been properly backed though.

None of us know what Ashley promised Benitez in order for him to stay but Rafa was clearly sold on the potential of our club and now feels like that isn't there anymore.

Ashley has tried to run the club like a business for over a decade now and has failed miserably because football clubs aren't like Sports Direct. He should either give Benitez more backing or sell up because what he has been doing and what he is doing isn't working for anyone.
So Rafa didn't feel he was totally backed in the Championship?

What does he actually want? The moon on a stick?

We were one of the biggest spenders. Yes we recouped a lot of money by selling but by Christ that man was backed to the hilt and beyond and that to some extent has been an issue for this window.
He wasn't backed in the January transfer window, no. We didn't sign anyone.

We made a £30m profit from our transfer dealings in the Championship. When you do that and then the next two windows are failures I find it hard to see that as being backed to the hilt and beyond.

In the last three windows we have spent about £85m and received about £100m. So since Benitez has been here we've made a profit from transfers of about £15m. That's not being backed in this day and age of football. It's also about how f***ing slow and ponderous we are in our transfer dealings so we miss out on targets we have lined up.

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Re: RAFA Future

Post by MultipleJesuses » Fri Sep 01, 2017 10:16 pm

Too many comments to quote but OT is killing it in this thread <applause>
Don't hinder the Trinder

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Re: RAFA Future

Post by overseasTOON » Fri Sep 01, 2017 10:19 pm

Mifune wrote:
overseasTOON wrote:
So Rafa didn't feel he was totally backed in the Championship?

What does he actually want? The moon on a stick?

We were one of the biggest spenders. Yes we recouped a lot of money by selling but by Christ that man was backed to the hilt and beyond and that to some extent has been an issue for this window.
He wasn't backed in the January transfer window, no. We didn't sign anyone.

We made a £30m profit from our transfer dealings in the Championship. When you do that and then the next two windows are failures I find it hard to see that as being backed to the hilt and beyond.

In the last three windows we have spent about £85m and received about £100m. So since Benitez has been here we've made a profit from transfers of about £15m. That's not being backed in this day and age of football. It's also about how f***ing slow and ponderous we are in our transfer dealings so we miss out on targets we have lined up.
The club also have wages to pay, infrastructure to maintain, replace and improve (be that bricks and mortar or IT), staff recruitment and training and all of these are not based on players. There are bills to pay in terms of water, electric and leases.

They also have to pay agents for the transfers for incoming.

They sell a player and they get payed in installments, rarely the full amount up front.

At what point do they have an adequate amount of money to go crazy in the transfer market?

The club was recently promoted. It was a pittance for that accolade compared to a team that was relegated last season.

That 'profit' likely tided the club over for the season without meaning the owner had to give another hefty loan but it was never £30 million available as its payed in installments.

He was backed fully in the main window we went down. There were already enough players never playing by the time January came around. Why invest again when you have redundant players not even making the bench?

These players were bought on the say so of Rafa?

I don't disagree we seem ponderous. I fully admit we seem to take an age and usually miss out and that is due to the board.

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Re: RAFA Future

Post by Blue & Maroon » Fri Sep 01, 2017 10:21 pm

TJR wrote:Decent effort from the Chronicle tomorrow.

[tweet][/tweet]
f***ing embarrassing and pathetic from the chronic as per <erk>

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Re: RAFA Future

Post by Donkey Toon » Fri Sep 01, 2017 10:22 pm

Mifune wrote:
overseasTOON wrote:
So Rafa didn't feel he was totally backed in the Championship?

What does he actually want? The moon on a stick?

We were one of the biggest spenders. Yes we recouped a lot of money by selling but by Christ that man was backed to the hilt and beyond and that to some extent has been an issue for this window.
He wasn't backed in the January transfer window, no. We didn't sign anyone.

We made a £30m profit from our transfer dealings in the Championship. When you do that and then the next two windows are failures I find it hard to see that as being backed to the hilt and beyond.

In the last three windows we have spent about £85m and received about £100m. So since Benitez has been here we've made a profit from transfers of about £15m. That's not being backed in this day and age of football. It's also about how f***ing slow and ponderous we are in our transfer dealings so we miss out on targets we have lined up.
We didn't need to make any transfers in the January window. We were in the top two and stayed there til the end. Just because Rafa wants more players doesn't mean he has to have them if the finances aren't there.

Yes we made a £30m profit from player transfers, but that is profit and loss and not cash flow. The accounts stated that we ended the season with zero in the bank and that we had made a cash loss from player transfers, meaning we paid cash upfront for our purchases but some of our sales were on credit. Everybody and their dog knows the Sissoko deal was six payments of £5m. Furthermore during the year Ashley had to put another £15m in to cover day to day expenses. In other words there was no money for transfers and the club were right not to buy another unnecessary championship player who no doubt would just be added to the list of players to be discarded because the are not PL quality.

And yeah profit of £15m from transfers but completely cancelled out and more by lost revenue from the relegation. Fans keep insisting the club is sat on piles of cash that it is too tight to spend. It isn't. Yet it still spent more than five clubs who had received tv monies above £100m. Rafa has been backed, he just hasn't been backed as much as he or some of the fans want. But then Rafa has a history of wanting the moon when it comes to transfer funds.

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Re: RAFA Future

Post by Donkey Toon » Fri Sep 01, 2017 10:28 pm

MultipleJesuses wrote:Too many comments to quote but OT is killing it in this thread <applause>
Seconded. <applause>

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Re: RAFA Future

Post by KetteringMag » Fri Sep 01, 2017 10:51 pm

He got £60m to spend and built a new squad , half of whom he was trying all summer to flog... I don't get why he seems to be revered as the new messiah here , in all fairness McLaren got £80m to spend so it at least shows that when the money is there he would be allowed it.

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Re: RAFA Future

Post by Hjl » Fri Sep 01, 2017 11:33 pm

To be honest I'm a bit tired of Rafas criticism of the ownership. At every place I've ever worked if you were as vocal about the ownership as he is you would be fired. His job is to work with them and improve things, not complain when things don't go his way. He's a great manager no doubt, but managing a relegation club is much harder than managing a club with money to burn.

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Re: RAFA Future

Post by Mifune » Sat Sep 02, 2017 12:33 am

@ OT and DT

I know there are other bills and such that cost money. Likewise there are other income streams other than transfer fees such as TV money, parachute payments, sponsorship, tickets money, etc. We will also be getting over £100m for being in the PL this season. I know we lost out on that £100m last season and the parachute payment will probably only cover about £40m of that and I know transfer fee we receive come in installments. We are though speculating a lot because we do not know for sure the financial situation or things that have been promised to Rafa.

That all said, why are all these problems Newcastle specific? We cannot be in a worse financial position than the likes of Brighton who spent almost £60m this summer. Why do we insist on paying transfers in one lump but accept transfer for our players in installments? Maybe so in three seasons everyone will have forgotten about the Sissoko money. Why if we are desperate for a certain player that could help us finish higher in the table (and make more money) can we not stake that out of the minimum £100m we know we will be receiving at the end of this season or the money we know we are getting for Sissoko?

End of the day we have had positions that have needed strengthening for a while now so either:
a) We have failed to identify players for these positions in which case Rafa and our scouting department are to blame.
b) We've had targets but failed to land them due to not wanting to spend the money needed to get them or being too slow. In this case Ashley and Charnley are to blame.
c) We have no money available to spend due to self-inflicted financial confines. In which case Ashley is responsible but only to blame if you disagree with his approach to running the club.
d) We've had the money but spent it in the wrong areas. In which case Rafa and Charnley are to blame.

I think if Rafa had been backed to a reasonable level we would've had a GK, LB, number 10 and a better strike force by now. I don't think that is unrealistic. I do acknowledge that the lack of outgoing has been an issue in freeing up squad space, but again that's not Rafa's job.

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Re: RAFA Future

Post by ALF » Sat Sep 02, 2017 12:35 am

Donkey Toon wrote:
MultipleJesuses wrote:Too many comments to quote but OT is killing it in this thread <applause>
Seconded. <applause>
Thirded.

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Re: RAFA Future

Post by ALF » Sat Sep 02, 2017 12:41 am

Mifune wrote:@ OT and DT

I think if Rafa had been backed to a reasonable level we would've had a GK, LB, number 10 and a better strike force by now. I don't think that is unrealistic. I do acknowledge that the lack of outgoing has been an issue in freeing up squad space, but again that's not Rafa's job.
We got screwed over for a back up LB by Chelsea and Southampton on deadline day and the week leading up to it.
I'm not sure how serious we were about a keeper, there were plenty of links but no advanced talks.
Number 10 is a strange one too, we weren't really linked with many despite most fans seeing it as a priority position. Maybe a plan is toplay Ritchie there.
We signed a striker. We chased Lucas Perez who didn't want to come here and sat waiting on Abraham for a few weeks as well even though he didn't want to come here.

Freeing up squad space isn't officially Rafa's job but managing his squad is. There are players he's signed that are surplus to requirements still here. He knew how big the squad was when he signed 12 players last summer and he knew how hard a lot of them would be to shift.

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Re: RAFA Future

Post by Mifune » Sat Sep 02, 2017 12:51 am

ALF wrote:
Mifune wrote:@ OT and DT

I think if Rafa had been backed to a reasonable level we would've had a GK, LB, number 10 and a better strike force by now. I don't think that is unrealistic. I do acknowledge that the lack of outgoing has been an issue in freeing up squad space, but again that's not Rafa's job.
We got screwed over for a back up LB by Chelsea and Southampton on deadline day and the week leading up to it.
I'm not sure how serious we were about a keeper, there were plenty of links but no advanced talks.
Number 10 is a strange one too, we weren't really linked with many despite most fans seeing it as a priority position. Maybe a plan is toplay Ritchie there.
We signed a striker. We chased Lucas Perez who didn't want to come here and sat waiting on Abraham for a few weeks as well even though he didn't want to come here.

Freeing up squad space isn't officially Rafa's job but managing his squad is. There are players he's signed that are surplus to requirements still here. He knew how big the squad was when he signed 12 players last summer and he knew how hard a lot of them would be to shift.
It should've been sorted well before the last week of the window though. That is part of not being backed sufficiently.

I agree that you can blame Rafa for signing some of the players that we are now trying to get rid of. But he was also buying players then that would help us get promoted which we did and now some of those players have served their purpose.

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Re: RAFA Future

Post by Mifune » Sat Sep 02, 2017 1:10 am

I think the difference in feeling about whether Rafa has been backed is probably down to season expectations.

If your expectations for this season is just to avoid relegation then I think this squad with Rafa as manager is good enough to stay up and so would agree he has been sufficiently backed to do this.

Rafa is a world class manager though and we are extremely fortunate to have him and should take advantage and not look to just avoid relegation. Now I don't think we should be looking for Europe this season or anything but a solid mid-table finish isn't delusional and would provide a better platform to progress again next season than just trying to survive. With our current squad I think that is going to be tough and really needed more backing to achieve it.

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Re: RAFA Future

Post by Aldridge Prior » Sat Sep 02, 2017 6:45 am

People on both sides of the fence getting rather passionate without knowing all the facts, does that sound familiar? <scratch>

Fwiw I'm still of the opinion that Ashley is the villain in all this and he's handled things terribly, particularly with that PR stunt of an interview with Sky which seemed to serve everyone but fans of our club.

The "I haven't got £200m to spend" quote was a pretty shitty dig at us and Rafa. He knows full well that no one expected anywhere near that amount but he's playing up to the "deluded/high expectation Geordies" narrative that the media and pundits love so much.

As for Rafa, well he needs to kerb this strop now. I don't think what he said about bringing in what he could, rather than what he wanted, was very nice at all. Imagine hearing that if you were Manquillo or Joselu. Hardly inspiring.

I think we'll be ok this season. We've strengthened overall since last year and cleared some dead wood in time for a January acquisition or two, or maybe for next season when I expect we'll have some good money to spend.

I just hope Rafa acknowledges that he's been put on a pedestal and uses it to OUR advantage, not to push his own agenda with the owner, who we all know is disinterested at best.

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Re: RAFA Future

Post by Lidl » Sat Sep 02, 2017 8:19 am

Latest group accounts available here if anyone fancies checking the financial state of things (as at June 2016) -https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/comp ... ory?page=1
If This Is How You Folks Make Art, Well That's f***ing Depressing

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Re: RAFA Future

Post by Toondes » Sat Sep 02, 2017 9:37 am

LiDL wrote:Latest group accounts available here if anyone fancies checking the financial state of things (as at June 2016) -https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/comp ... ory?page=1
Are this years not available ?
# stolen from nufc.com :)

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Re: RAFA Future

Post by Speedo » Sat Sep 02, 2017 9:58 am

Toondes wrote:
LiDL wrote:Latest group accounts available here if anyone fancies checking the financial state of things (as at June 2016) -https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/comp ... ory?page=1
Are this years not available ?
No, 2016-17 accounts usually come out in April the following year.
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