Federico Fernandez 6m Done Deal

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Re: Federico Fernandez 6m Done Deal

Post by TJR » Tue Aug 14, 2018 3:09 pm

The team was definitely visibly better with him in it. At the time we had two no nonsense CBs (Iron Mike & Saylor) and Colo as a more cultured ball playing CB. He complimented his partner and his partner complimented him. It was a good combination. Also regardless of playing style, Colo was the best defender at the club.

Similar to Lascelles and Lejeune. We really missed Lejeune on Saturday, we were trying to play out from the back but normally Lascelles leaves that to him. Clark is more similar to Lascelles than Lejeune in that respected and we did struggle at times to play out. Hopefully Fernandez will be a more natural Lejeune replacement.

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Re: Federico Fernandez 6m Done Deal

Post by TBC » Tue Aug 14, 2018 4:38 pm

I think Schär is more of a ball playing CB but Rafa has worked with Fernández before so who knows who he’ll go with.
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Re: Federico Fernandez 6m Done Deal

Post by ALF » Tue Aug 14, 2018 6:10 pm

Colo was a s*** captain but for a few years he was a top defender.

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Re: Federico Fernandez 6m Done Deal

Post by Bodacious Benny » Tue Aug 14, 2018 6:23 pm

Yea, agree that he was a top defender in his prime, but he was a crap captain.
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Re: Federico Fernandez 6m Done Deal

Post by omegaprimevkm » Wed Aug 15, 2018 11:42 am

Remember Colo wrote:
Tue Aug 14, 2018 2:37 pm
Didn't visibly improve the team? What revisionist history. It's no coincidence the team always did worse when he was out injured. And I guess I just imagined that 5th place season - which at this rate, was the best result in ages, and likely will remain that way for years to come.

More than half of that long write-up is conjecture about off-field stuff, and has nothing to do with his generally strong on-field play, when he was typically surrounded by a circus of frequently injured or otherwise mediocre defenders.

We'll clearly never agree on this, so I won't try convincing you, but it does highlight that the perception of him from some fans is heavily influenced by the off-field rumours and stories, while other fans care less about that. I'm not saying one side is right or wrong, just different.
But it wasn't as simple as that - on field he had the armband and was the biggest earner in the team but showed no leadership, game management and had no authority about him. He made mistakes (as all defenders do) but not those that you'd associate with a big money signing, and didn't have the professionalism long term either.

The thing that always will bug me was following that 5th placed finish, and the likes of Nolan and Smith (players I don't even like, admittedly) leaving the dressing room, no one seemed to care or willing to stand up in times of strain. We have Rafa and Lascelles now standing up and admitting failings but also cajoling troops into action. A lack of investment now is countered by a team driving and playing together - back then we had investment but neither accountability nor dedication.

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Re: Federico Fernandez 6m Done Deal

Post by Colly » Wed Aug 15, 2018 11:57 am

He was never going to be a shouty captain though, he led by example and for at least three seasons in an ever changing squad did that admirably. The idea he couldn't organise a defense is farcical though, as the stats and anyone who heard him whistle his way through a game can account. I miss that whistle.

Your time line is a bit off too given the 5th place came after Nolan and Jose had gone, with Smith and Barton barely involved.

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Re: Federico Fernandez 6m Done Deal

Post by Bodacious Benny » Wed Aug 15, 2018 12:48 pm

Being a captain is more than just what you do on the pitch, off the pitch I can only recall seeing him do one post match TV interview. He's supposed to represent the team and the club in victory and defeat, part of a captains role is to do those kind of things. Whether we got hammered (as we did, even when we finished 5th) or whether we'd won he should've been in front of the cameras getting his perspective across to fans.
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Re: Federico Fernandez 6m Done Deal

Post by Remember Colo » Wed Aug 15, 2018 2:32 pm

Bodacious Benny wrote:
Wed Aug 15, 2018 12:48 pm
Being a captain is more than just what you do on the pitch, off the pitch I can only recall seeing him do one post match TV interview. He's supposed to represent the team and the club in victory and defeat, part of a captains role is to do those kind of things. Whether we got hammered (as we did, even when we finished 5th) or whether we'd won he should've been in front of the cameras getting his perspective across to fans.
And even as a huge fan of his I'll admit that was the weakest part of his captaincy. Although most of those post-match athlete interviews are garbage anyway, so I maybe don't put as much weight into those as others do. He seemed to play a huge role in the dressing room though, not dissimilar from Nolan (except the player cliques were different nationalities). I find it interesting that Nolan is held up on a pedestal for his leadership, while he's denigrated for it, despite the fact one's team achieved more, and both had issues with management towards the end. To immediately clarify, I'm not saying Colo was a better captain, just that they appear to carry very different legacies.

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Re: Federico Fernandez 6m Done Deal

Post by Bodacious Benny » Wed Aug 15, 2018 3:03 pm

Remember Colo wrote:
Wed Aug 15, 2018 2:32 pm
Bodacious Benny wrote:
Wed Aug 15, 2018 12:48 pm
Being a captain is more than just what you do on the pitch, off the pitch I can only recall seeing him do one post match TV interview. He's supposed to represent the team and the club in victory and defeat, part of a captains role is to do those kind of things. Whether we got hammered (as we did, even when we finished 5th) or whether we'd won he should've been in front of the cameras getting his perspective across to fans.
And even as a huge fan of his I'll admit that was the weakest part of his captaincy. Although most of those post-match athlete interviews are garbage anyway, so I maybe don't put as much weight into those as others do. He seemed to play a huge role in the dressing room though, not dissimilar from Nolan (except the player cliques were different nationalities). I find it interesting that Nolan is held up on a pedestal for his leadership, while he's denigrated for it, despite the fact one's team achieved more, and both had issues with management towards the end. To immediately clarify, I'm not saying Colo was a better captain, just that they appear to carry very different legacies.
Yeah, a lot of the time TV interviews can just be players reeling out some generic statements, but I still like to see them come out and say something. It's nice to see the occasions where players come out and say it as it is rather than worrying about saying what the club will want them to say.
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Re: Federico Fernandez 6m Done Deal

Post by ALF » Wed Aug 15, 2018 9:23 pm

Bodacious Benny wrote:
Wed Aug 15, 2018 12:48 pm
Being a captain is more than just what you do on the pitch, off the pitch I can only recall seeing him do one post match TV interview. He's supposed to represent the team and the club in victory and defeat, part of a captains role is to do those kind of things. Whether we got hammered (as we did, even when we finished 5th) or whether we'd won he should've been in front of the cameras getting his perspective across to fans.

He threw a hell of a party though.

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Re: Federico Fernandez 6m Done Deal

Post by omegaprimevkm » Thu Aug 16, 2018 8:56 am

Colly wrote:
Wed Aug 15, 2018 11:57 am
He was never going to be a shouty captain though, he led by example and for at least three seasons in an ever changing squad did that admirably. The idea he couldn't organise a defense is farcical though, as the stats and anyone who heard him whistle his way through a game can account. I miss that whistle.

Your time line is a bit off too given the 5th place came after Nolan and Jose had gone, with Smith and Barton barely involved.
Well I was referring to the actual senior players leaving and the good times having gone in general, after that 5th placed finish. Nothing memorable, besides regular capitulation, was commonplace thereafter.

It was after he left that change somehow manifested. Ashley actually dipped into his pocket for once and bought Thauvin, Mbemba, Wijnaldum and Mitrovic. His timing was abysmal, it was almost as if he knew McClaren was such a poor manager that he needed that spending.

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