Earth discussion. What is Earth?

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Re: Earth discussion. What is Earth?

Post by ghostrider » Fri May 20, 2016 3:24 pm

Donkey Toon wrote:Reading back through this I've had to keep pinching myself to make sure i'm not dreaming.

Leaving the science aside, because let's face it ghostrider is adamant that he is not going to accept it
I'll accept any science that can be proved and not hidden from us. The stuff I'm questioning has not real physical proof.
Donkey Toon wrote: my question would be; what would be the purpose in all the scientists, world leaders, pilots, sailors, astronauts, round the world yachtsmen and countless other ordinary travellers, conspiring to create this great spherical world myth?
All scientists are many in different fields. Some do fantastic work and some are merely theorists. Others are merely fronts for the benefit of us.
World leaders are merely puppets. Actors like Ronald Reagan and potentials like Arnold Schwarzenegger, etc. Seriously?
Pilots just follow orders. They fly on instruments by a flight plan. Sailors just follow orders and follow a set out plan.They don't have to be in on anything.
Astronauts. There's no such thing as an astronaut as far as I'm concerned. Aquanaut maybe. Actornauts, definitely. Round the world yachtsmen use a compass. East and west would be going around in a circle.
It's a big world and very few people, if any actually know the truth of what it is. There's plenty that know what it isn't - and that's a spinning globe.
Most probably many genuine scientists know it's not a globe but what do you do? Do you shout it from the roof tops and lose your job and be called a nut case conspiracy theorist or a tin foil hat? Nah, I'm sure 99% would ratehr earn good money and who can blame them.

Donkey Toon wrote: There is nothing to gain from it, but it would be the conspiracy of all conspiracies to manufacture and maintain, requiring countless millions of people to agree to lie about personal experiences
Very few would have to lie about personal experiences. Some could be doing it because they're told it's for good reason. Who really knows.
Every day you're being told white lies and big lies. Actors are paid good money in order to make you believe a scene is real. most people aren't stupid but they will cry over an acted scene. they will spend hours talking about a plot in a film the next day.
Do you not believe a bunch of actors in suits can make kids and adults believe they're taking a crap in a special space station toilet or brushing their teeth or eating a burrito, etc, etc?
Simon Helberg from the big bang, playing Howard Wallowitz was floating about in his space station. Did he go up there in a rocket or was there a place he could go to shoot the scenes?
We can easily be duped into believing anything if the right person is put in front of us to push it.
Donkey Toon wrote: to fake maps of the world, to conspire to organise and maintain a fake international transportation system which would actually incur a huge financial burden (because for example the USA could not export both east and west from its borders and expect them to reach the same country, UK exports would have to go east or west depending on where the earth ends) and yet despite living on this planet for nearly 50 years i've never witnessed or heard of a single fact or report to suggest that the world is not as described and as far as i'm aware those who dispute it are so rare as to be virtually non-existent.
How many people do you know that use a globe map to travel anywhere?
Donkey Toon wrote:Ghostrider you are trying to sound clever by spouting pseudo-scientific word salad whilst at the same time showing a cronic lack of logic and common sense.
I'm not trying to sound clever. I''m merely giving my thoughts out for people to ponder and debate if they so wish. I'm simply saying, question stuff.
What I think, I think from my own point of view. I do not expect anyone to follow it in any way shape or form. That's entirely down to each individual as to whether they can see valid points or not, or whether they feel that I'm a stark raving nut case. I'm not in control of others thoughts.
Donkey Toon wrote: I'm 99% certain you are a troll, but in case you aren't I suggest seeing a shrink.
No shrink needed for simply having thoughts on a forum, I don't think.

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Re: Earth discussion. What is Earth?

Post by ghostrider » Fri May 20, 2016 3:32 pm

Ramone wrote:
ghostrider wrote: So gravity as a force is curvature of space time. Can you briefly explain how?

I can only guess what electro-magnetism truly is. I don't profess to know it all. I'm merely saying that neither do so called expert scientists. It's all guesswork and made up nonsensical theories in my opinion, such as curvature of space time.
Just because you don't understand something, that does mean it's not true.
Correct, it doesn't. We also shouldn't be expected to be bullied into believing stuff by authority and should be allowed to question anything they cannot directly prove.

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Re: Earth discussion. What is Earth?

Post by Hjl » Fri May 20, 2016 3:33 pm

i just gave you a real life example of gravity in action that disproves your pressure theory.

Im rather enjoying this argument. It is allowing me to really analyse my own understanding of physics and develop it myself.

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Re: Earth discussion. What is Earth?

Post by Donkey Toon » Fri May 20, 2016 3:33 pm

You just went to great lengths to give us loads more word salad without answering the main question.

Why would all these conspirators bother to create and maintain this conspiracy? If the earth is as you suggest not a spinning globe why would the people of the world decide that that truth couldn't/shouldn't be known and go to the trouble of faking our perceived realty that it is spherical (almost) without a need to do so?

But don't bother answering you are quite obviously a troll or insane. I'm guessing both.
Last edited by Donkey Toon on Fri May 20, 2016 3:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Earth discussion. What is Earth?

Post by Colback's Orange Tufts » Fri May 20, 2016 3:37 pm

ghostrider wrote:
Cisse's Overheating Torso wrote:
The curvature of spacetime.

Can you tell us what electro-magnetism is? Particularly without using all that so called physics you don't believe in
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Exchange of photons innit
So gravity as a force is curvature of space time. Can you briefly explain how?

I can only guess what electro-magnetism truly is. I don't profess to know it all. I'm merely saying that neither do so called expert scientists. It's all guesswork and made up nonsensical theories in my opinion, such as curvature of space time.
So you prefer to reject a well rounded (and evidenced despite your distain of that evidence) group of theories in favour of your own viewpoint that can't explain how fridge magnets, filament light bulbs or speakers work? The whole point of the scientific method is to chose the best available theories until a better one comes along.
Physics' theories clearly beat yours because they can explain items such as bulbs and have helped in the development on microchips, carbon fibre, planes, cars etc

Curvature of space time: Mass basically deforms the space that objects travel through (space time). So if one is on travelling on a straight path, the effect of mass curves the plane you move through and diverts your path.
The classic 2D analogy is putting a weight on the middle of a trampoline. If you roll a ball along the the trampoline (but not hitting the centre), it will divert from a straight path because the weight has caused the trampoline to sink in the centre. The heavier the weight, the more curvature.
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Re: Earth discussion. What is Earth?

Post by Colback's Orange Tufts » Fri May 20, 2016 3:45 pm

Cisse's Overheating Torso wrote:
Ramone wrote:This thread made me so angry.
I love this thread, all the arguing <awe>
This. I wonder if wolf_the_mag and ghostrider know each other? We should introduce them
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Re: Earth discussion. What is Earth?

Post by ghostrider » Fri May 20, 2016 3:53 pm

Hjl wrote:Simply put:

When designing a steel structure, the mass of a girder must be considered in the construction of that structure.
I have no problem with that. A construction is stacked just as atmosphere is stacked. A construction at every point in a build of dense mass, displaces atmosphere at 14.7 psi. This is what the construction is acting against for each piece of the build that displaces pressure.
Atmosphere is just a less dense version of water. Drop iron blocks into a swimming pool and those iron blocks will displace their own mass of water which will be forced around and above, creating pressure upon the block. Just like atmosphere. No gravity involved.
Hjl wrote:The columns at the base of a structure must be able to support the combined loading of all of the structure above that.
Agreed.
Hjl wrote:The reason that they must support the loading from the structure above is because the mass of the columns and beams acts in a downward direction, always, regardless of where you are, towards the same exact locus. This locus can be shown to meet at the center of the earth.
Imagine someone tells you to build a tower of blocks 50 feet high and you were strong as hell. You hold a block and then pick up another and place it under the first block. The block you picked up had now pushed that first block higher and your body being the foundation feels that extra pressure of that push up. You keep doing this and as you do, you're displacing the air under your arms with each block and also above you at the top. Again, there's no gravity, it's just pressure upon mass/density.
Hjl wrote:If you were to build your structure on a moving platform, an oil rig for instance, then as the platform moves, the forces do not act perpendicular to the platform, they act in line with the same locus as before. The center of the earth.

This situation simply would not occur if the only thing pushing things together was pressure.
There's two forces acting. The atmosphere pushing back against the structure again st the structure against the sea and its buoyancy due to it being hollow.
Hjl wrote:What is this force that always acts along the same line regardless of the objects alignment to the earths surface? We call it gravity. Or smerselwingdangus if you prefer. The name doesn't make a difference. It is what it is.
I call it denpressure. Atmospheric pressure upon density.

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Re: Earth discussion. What is Earth?

Post by Hjl » Fri May 20, 2016 3:58 pm

Ah ha! Then I have you!

Why then if the thing holding objects to the ground is atmospheric pressure, do these reactions still take place exactly the same way in a vacuum!

That has been proven time and time again.

Thank you for the discussion. I'm glad I could be a part of this.

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Re: Earth discussion. What is Earth?

Post by Ramone » Fri May 20, 2016 4:38 pm

Cisse's Overheating Torso wrote:
Cisse's Overheating Torso wrote:
I love this thread, all the arguing <awe>
This. I wonder if wolf_the_mag and ghostrider know each other? We should introduce them
They must be the same person, surely.

EDIT: They are
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Re: Earth discussion. What is Earth?

Post by Ramone » Fri May 20, 2016 4:54 pm

If this ridiculous theory is true and thousands of shills have been employed to maintain it over hundreds of years, how is it that a person such as yourself has been able to uncover it? Surely the vast resources of this international conspiracy could have enforced your silence one way or another.

Also, you mentioned that many scientists "know" that the world is not a sphere yet they refuse to come out with this information for fear of losing their jobs. If that is the case why haven't there been any deathbed confessions? Why aren't retired scientists coming out and saying something? Why hasn't a group of whistleblowers banded together to inform the public?

I suspect that you don't truly believe any of this nonsense deep down, yet proclaiming it as true makes you feel like an individual. It makes you feel that you are the enlightened and intelligent one amongst a group of dim-witted sheep.

You're not.

Get a job and a girlfriend.
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Re: Earth discussion. What is Earth?

Post by Donkey Toon » Fri May 20, 2016 5:24 pm

Ramone wrote:If this ridiculous theory is true and thousands of shills have been employed to maintain it over hundreds of years, how is it that a person such as yourself has been able to uncover it? Surely the vast resources of this international conspiracy could have enforced your silence one way or another.

Also, you mentioned that many scientists "know" that the world is not a sphere yet they refuse to come out with this information for fear of losing their jobs. If that is the case why haven't there been any deathbed confessions? Why aren't retired scientists coming out and saying something? Why hasn't a group of whistleblowers banded together to inform the public?

I suspect that you don't truly believe any of this nonsense deep down, yet proclaiming it as true makes you feel like an individual. It makes you feel that you are the enlightened and intelligent one amongst a group of dim-witted sheep.

You're not.

Get a job and a girlfriend.
A real girlfriend. Not one only you can see.

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Re: Earth discussion. What is Earth?

Post by Hjl » Fri May 20, 2016 5:35 pm

Donkey Toon wrote:
Ramone wrote:If this ridiculous theory is true and thousands of shills have been employed to maintain it over hundreds of years, how is it that a person such as yourself has been able to uncover it? Surely the vast resources of this international conspiracy could have enforced your silence one way or another.

Also, you mentioned that many scientists "know" that the world is not a sphere yet they refuse to come out with this information for fear of losing their jobs. If that is the case why haven't there been any deathbed confessions? Why aren't retired scientists coming out and saying something? Why hasn't a group of whistleblowers banded together to inform the public?

I suspect that you don't truly believe any of this nonsense deep down, yet proclaiming it as true makes you feel like an individual. It makes you feel that you are the enlightened and intelligent one amongst a group of dim-witted sheep.

You're not.

Get a job and a girlfriend.
A real girlfriend. Not one only you can see.
A smart man once told me it is cheaper to just rent it in the long run.

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Re: Earth discussion. What is Earth?

Post by ghostrider » Fri May 20, 2016 5:52 pm

Hjl wrote:Ah ha! Then I have you!

Why then if the thing holding objects to the ground is atmospheric pressure, do these reactions still take place exactly the same way in a vacuum!

That has been proven time and time again.

Thank you for the discussion. I'm glad I could be a part of this.
A vacuum cannot be created. Only lowered pressure.

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Re: Earth discussion. What is Earth?

Post by ghostrider » Fri May 20, 2016 5:53 pm

Ramone wrote:
Cisse's Overheating Torso wrote:
This. I wonder if wolf_the_mag and ghostrider know each other? We should introduce them
They must be the same person, surely.

EDIT: They are
Yes that was my other name but I can't find a password for it so I used this one. If I can get a password for it I'll bin this one or you can bin the wolf the mag one.

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Re: Earth discussion. What is Earth?

Post by Hjl » Fri May 20, 2016 5:56 pm

ghostrider wrote:
Hjl wrote:Ah ha! Then I have you!

Why then if the thing holding objects to the ground is atmospheric pressure, do these reactions still take place exactly the same way in a vacuum!

That has been proven time and time again.

Thank you for the discussion. I'm glad I could be a part of this.
A vacuum cannot be created. Only lowered pressure.
Ok so what? At 99% vacuum things should have far less weight than at normal pressure. How come this is simply not true? A scale with an object inside a glass box with a vacuum will read exactly the same as a scale outside the box,
Your arguement has completely fallen apart. <dotheameobi>

Force = mass x acceleration.

N= kg x ms^-2

Without acceleration there is no force. Without force there is nothing acting on anything.

This is extremely basic stuff.....

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Re: Earth discussion. What is Earth?

Post by ghostrider » Fri May 20, 2016 6:00 pm

Ramone wrote:If this ridiculous theory is true and thousands of shills have been employed to maintain it over hundreds of years, how is it that a person such as yourself has been able to uncover it? Surely the vast resources of this international conspiracy could have enforced your silence one way or another.
My silence for what? All I'm doing is questioning and putting my thoughts in for people to think about. I expect nothing more than simple debate or people counteracting what I say. It's no more big a deal than that.
Ramone wrote:Also, you mentioned that many scientists "know" that the world is not a sphere yet they refuse to come out with this information for fear of losing their jobs. If that is the case why haven't there been any deathbed confessions? Why aren't retired scientists coming out and saying something? Why hasn't a group of whistleblowers banded together to inform the public?
Ok let's put it that I believe many scientists know. Am I wrong? who really knows?
Ramone wrote:I suspect that you don't truly believe any of this nonsense deep down, yet proclaiming it as true makes you feel like an individual. It makes you feel that you are the enlightened and intelligent one amongst a group of dim-witted sheep.

You're not.

Get a job and a girlfriend.
I absolutely truly 100% believe that the Earth is NOT spinning globe in a space vacuum and all the rest of the stuff that goes with it to keep it alive.

I'm well aware of what it makes me in many people's eyes and I'm also well aware that many people use the "get a girlfriend" ..."get out of the basement" terms. I accept it all because I'm under no illusions about how strong the global saturation is, as well as a lot of supposed scientific space gunk.

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Re: Earth discussion. What is Earth?

Post by ghostrider » Fri May 20, 2016 6:03 pm

Hjl wrote:
ghostrider wrote: A vacuum cannot be created. Only lowered pressure.
Ok so what? At 99% vacuum things should have far less weight than at normal pressure. How come this is simply not true? A scale with an object inside a glass box with a vacuum will read exactly the same as a scale outside the box,
Your arguement has completely fallen apart. <dotheameobi>

Force = mass x acceleration.

N= kg x ms^-2

Without acceleration there is no force. Without force there is nothing acting on anything.

This is extremely basic stuff.....
A scale is calibrated under atmospheric pressure. It's built under atmospheric pressure.

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Re: Earth discussion. What is Earth?

Post by Hjl » Fri May 20, 2016 6:05 pm

That's not how scales work, they measure the force that an object exerts on the plate and display that as numerical value, they have nothing to do with pressure

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Re: Earth discussion. What is Earth?

Post by Bodacious Benny » Fri May 20, 2016 6:06 pm

I was lost a long time ago.
I'm the scumbag outlaw. You're the pillar of justice. Neither of us like looking at ourselves in the mirror. Do we have a deal?

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Re: Earth discussion. What is Earth?

Post by ghostrider » Fri May 20, 2016 6:07 pm

Hjl wrote:That's not how scales work, they measure the force that an object exerts on the plate and display that as numerical value, they have nothing to do with pressure
They have everything to do with pressure.

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