Political rant

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Political rant

Post by Wot lad? » Sun Feb 26, 2012 4:27 pm

Has anyone been following US politics?

Ron Paul really is Americas last chance for freedom. The debt bill is in the trillions and what a surprise, Obama has increased military action and spending. Ron is more liberal than the democrats whilst also being more conservative than the his fellow republicans. If he loses we are looking at a war with Iran, an Iran that is progressing and not the evil backwater the media tries to make out. The BBC and mainstream news is VERY good at making you think Armedinijad is a crazy dictator. Hes not, hes balanced and not blinded by ignorance. Cameron is far more corrupt.

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; - watch the bias here and how rational he is.

We are f***ed in this country, nobody will vote in greens or UKIP, almost any independant would do a better job, i always vote independant. Its because at the highest level all 3 major parties are controlled by the same interests, the puppetmasters. We may elect new puppets every 5 years but its the same hands pulling the strings. Ever wondered why things never seem to get better? The only chance for true freedom again would be a large scale revolt and forceful removal of the government.

The Torys and Labour both want people dependant on benefits, a smaller middle class and a population that questions less and is dumbed down. They play off against each other and maintain the power structure, the liberals are irrelevant and part of the structure anyway, they provide an extra option to placate the masses, but as we have seen Clegg was in on it all along, those in power covered all the bases.

Image

This is UK politics defined by one image. Two cards resting against each other to maintain the pyramids structure.

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Any thoughts? Thanks for reading.
Last edited by Wot lad? on Mon Feb 27, 2012 1:56 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Political rant

Post by Seagull » Sun Feb 26, 2012 5:43 pm

Woah. First off, Obama hasn't increased military spending, he's actually retrenched the military, removing troops from areas in Europe and only leaving the bare minimum in the Asia Pacific, to ensure security. The US have cut military spending significantly.

I don't really have the time watch the video but I do agree generally with what you're saying, although I think that a party like the Greens could do a better job than Labour or Conservative but maybe that's just because of my political standing. I think the nature of party politics is incredibly restrictive to be honest, with MPs being forced to 'toe the party line' and side with the official party view. So yeah, I do agree with political reform but suggestions of a revolution are a bit excessive.

Power corrupts, though.
Last edited by Seagull on Sun Feb 26, 2012 5:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Political rant

Post by Blue & Maroon » Sun Feb 26, 2012 5:53 pm

Image

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Re: Political rant

Post by Blue & Maroon » Sun Feb 26, 2012 5:55 pm

Has someone been reading Karl Marx recently? <laugh>

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Re: Political rant

Post by Wot lad? » Sun Feb 26, 2012 10:33 pm

No i havent been reading marx recently, i have held the same views for a long long time, i read a wide variety of philosophy amongst other research and formulate my own views on things. Why be so condecending? There are many over-zealous types out there who love to go against the grain and will believe any crackpot theory they come accross, but you cant tar everyone with the same brush, its incredibly ignorant and prejudice.

In response to "I want curly hair", if you dig a little deeper you will find that the issue is not as black and white as it may seem. I stand corrected when i said he increased military spending i should have said "intends to increase", which he has outlined plans for and will do if he gets re-elected if not beforehand.

http://www.salon.com/2011/04/14/obama_d ... singleton/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://startthinkingright.wordpress.com ... ible-ever/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Morever there is a vast amount of clandestine filtering of funds and hand in glove stuff that happens behind the stage curtain. Obama has raised the debt from 10 trillion to 14 trillion, you cannot buy your way out of debt. If thats not evidence for corruption at the highest level i dont know what is.
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Re: Political rant

Post by Amnesiac » Sun Feb 26, 2012 11:04 pm

The Dream Boat wrote:Has someone been reading Karl Marx recently? <laugh>
Yes I have <scratch>

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Re: Political rant

Post by Blue & Maroon » Sun Feb 26, 2012 11:43 pm

nom de plume wrote:No i havent been reading marx recently, i have held the same views for a long long time, i read a wide variety of philosophy amongst other research and formulate my own views on things. Why be so condecending? There are many over-zealous types out there who love to go against the grain and will believe any crackpot theory they come accross, but you cant tar everyone with the same brush, its incredibly ignorant and prejudice.

In response to "I want curly hair", if you dig a little deeper you will find that the issue is not as black and white as it may seem. I stand corrected when i said he increased military spending i should have said "intends to increase", which he has outlined plans for and will do if he gets re-elected if not beforehand.

http://www.salon.com/2011/04/14/obama_d ... singleton/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://startthinkingright.wordpress.com ... ible-ever/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Morever there is a vast amount of clandestine filtering of funds and hand in glove stuff that happens behind the stage curtain. Obama has raised the debt from 10 trillion to 14 trillion, you cannot buy your way out of debt. If thats not evidence for corruption at the highest level i dont know what is.
Because you will do the same to me. Anything I say will have been brainwashed into me by the media according to you, pretty pointless even having a debate because you will be right and obviously I will be be wrong.

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Re: Political rant

Post by Wot lad? » Sun Feb 26, 2012 11:51 pm

The Dream Boat wrote:
Because you will do the same to me. Anything I say will have been brainwashed into me by the media according to you, pretty pointless even having a debate because you will be right and obviously I will be be wrong.
We are all influenced by societal pressures, thats inescapable, i am no more or less "brainwashed" than you, just like i am no better or worse than you, just different.

If its pointless to have a debate with me then why make a needless and arrogant comment in the firstplace?
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Re: Political rant

Post by Blue & Maroon » Mon Feb 27, 2012 12:11 am

nom de plume wrote:
The Dream Boat wrote:
Because you will do the same to me. Anything I say will have been brainwashed into me by the media according to you, pretty pointless even having a debate because you will be right and obviously I will be be wrong.
We are all influenced by societal pressures, thats inescapable, i am no more or less "brainwashed" than you, just like i am no better or worse than you, just different.

If its pointless to have a debate with me then why make a needless and arrogant comment in the firstplace?
Because i'm an arrogant person. <ok> We are all influenced by social factors but we don't necessarily conform to or follow any of them. Just because I watch Sky news (for the sake of argument) doesn't mean I subscribe to their beliefs. Sorry but ''left-wing'' (hate the term left or right wing its backwards, it's just for simplicity) people like you seem to think that anyone with a view dissimilar to their own has been brainwashed into them by the capitalist system or whatever, therefore even though you say yourself that you have been influenced by sources, equally bias as ones I could pull up you will refute everything I say on the basis that mine are bias because most likely come from mainstream media sources.

So in short it's a pointless debate to have, you will push your agenda and not listen and I will push mine and not listen to yours.

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Re: Political rant

Post by Wot lad? » Mon Feb 27, 2012 12:37 am

The Dream Boat wrote:
nom de plume wrote:
We are all influenced by societal pressures, thats inescapable, i am no more or less "brainwashed" than you, just like i am no better or worse than you, just different.

If its pointless to have a debate with me then why make a needless and arrogant comment in the firstplace?
Because i'm an arrogant person. <ok> We are all influenced by social factors but we don't necessarily conform to or follow any of them. Just because I watch Sky news (for the sake of argument) doesn't mean I subscribe to their beliefs. Sorry but ''left-wing'' (hate the term left or right wing its backwards, it's just for simplicity) people like you seem to think that anyone with a view dissimilar to their own has been brainwashed into them by the capitalist system or whatever, therefore even though you say yourself that you have been influenced by sources, equally bias as ones I could pull up you will refute everything I say on the basis that mine are bias because most likely come from mainstream media sources.

So in short it's a pointless debate to have, you will push your agenda and not listen and I will push mine and not listen to yours.
Fair enough pal, you showed of humility and that goes a long way with me, i think continuing the discussion will ultimately be futile. All i would say is that you shouldnt be so quick to make assumptions on my character and my beliefs just because you can piece a few pieces of the puzzle together from previous comments i have made, i am a complex man. I am not going to flip-flop from one spectrum to the other but i will listen to reason and rationale, im not afraid to change my views on most subjects.


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Re: Political rant

Post by Blue & Maroon » Mon Feb 27, 2012 12:43 am

nom de plume wrote:
The Dream Boat wrote:
Because i'm an arrogant person. <ok> We are all influenced by social factors but we don't necessarily conform to or follow any of them. Just because I watch Sky news (for the sake of argument) doesn't mean I subscribe to their beliefs. Sorry but ''left-wing'' (hate the term left or right wing its backwards, it's just for simplicity) people like you seem to think that anyone with a view dissimilar to their own has been brainwashed into them by the capitalist system or whatever, therefore even though you say yourself that you have been influenced by sources, equally bias as ones I could pull up you will refute everything I say on the basis that mine are bias because most likely come from mainstream media sources.

So in short it's a pointless debate to have, you will push your agenda and not listen and I will push mine and not listen to yours.
Fair enough pal, you showed of humility and that goes a long way with me, i think continuing the discussion will ultimately be futile. All i would say is that you shouldnt be so quick to make assumptions on my character and my beliefs just because you can piece a few pieces of the puzzle together from previous comments i have made, i am a complex man. I am not going to flip-flop from one spectrum to the other but i will listen to reason and rationale, im not afraid to change my views on most subjects.


"The only means of strengthening one's intellect is to make up one's mind about nothing, to let the mind be a thoroughfare for all thoughts." - John Keats
Fair dos <ok>

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Re: Political rant

Post by KingoStarr » Mon Feb 27, 2012 7:27 pm

Obama is the Don, nuff said
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Re: Political rant

Post by Chip Chipperson » Tue Feb 28, 2012 1:03 pm

Did anyone know that Obama's black?
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Re: Political rant

Post by The Situation » Tue Feb 28, 2012 6:40 pm

Hhmm you may want to do some more research on Iran as they are far from progressing, the reality is Iran are alot more desperate then they are dangerous, its economy is collapsing under stringent sanctions, its allys are struggling i.e Syria and Ahmadinejad has suffered humilation due to the supreme leader Ayatullah. It is becoming more and more isolated and the regime is unpopular domestically. For me the press want you to believe they are big and powerful to create a common enemy but they are actually fading!

As for this country the system is obviously corrupt exemplified by the expenses and News of the World scandals, but a mass revolt whilst exciting is not the answer. Changing the structure might be, change the pay scheme of MP's so they get £20,000 a year it sounds unfair but at the moment the job only attracts people who want power and money so they are obviously going to twist it for their own benefit!

Also Green peace and UKIP focus too much on one area they need to expand their image if they are going to get any where near parliament.

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Re: Political rant

Post by Wot lad? » Tue Feb 28, 2012 8:20 pm

The Situation wrote:Hhmm you may want to do some more research on Iran as they are far from progressing, the reality is Iran are alot more desperate then they are dangerous, its economy is collapsing under stringent sanctions, its allys are struggling i.e Syria and Ahmadinejad has suffered humilation due to the supreme leader Ayatullah. It is becoming more and more isolated and the regime is unpopular domestically. For me the press want you to believe they are big and powerful to create a common enemy but they are actually fading!

As for this country the system is obviously corrupt exemplified by the expenses and News of the World scandals, but a mass revolt whilst exciting is not the answer. Changing the structure might be, change the pay scheme of MP's so they get £20,000 a year it sounds unfair but at the moment the job only attracts people who want power and money so they are obviously going to twist it for their own benefit!

Also Green peace and UKIP focus too much on one area they need to expand their image if they are going to get any where near parliament.
I agree with most of your points but how can you change a corrupt structure to an appreciable level when the people who make the laws are the very ones who are corrupt in the first place?

Moreover i never said Iran was big and powerful, i think we can all agree an open mind is needed for this subject. I will do more research, what sources have you used to draw those conclusions? Its hard to find the real facts and i am clearly not knowledgeable enough on the subject, if Iran has suffered to such an extent from sactions that its not progressing at all in any social, infrastructural or economic facets then i really feel for the Iranian people.

Is Iran actually falling apart at the seams? or just progressing at a slower and slower rate? I only ask because i have spoken to Iranians recently that said their country was progressing, a good place and not what its been made out to be. They themselves are likely to be influenced by media etc so my evidence from a few Iranians and news sources doesnt seem to stand up very well. I will retract my comments.
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Re: Political rant

Post by skalpel » Tue Feb 28, 2012 8:37 pm

nom de plume wrote:
The Situation wrote:Hhmm you may want to do some more research on Iran as they are far from progressing, the reality is Iran are alot more desperate then they are dangerous, its economy is collapsing under stringent sanctions, its allys are struggling i.e Syria and Ahmadinejad has suffered humilation due to the supreme leader Ayatullah. It is becoming more and more isolated and the regime is unpopular domestically. For me the press want you to believe they are big and powerful to create a common enemy but they are actually fading!

As for this country the system is obviously corrupt exemplified by the expenses and News of the World scandals, but a mass revolt whilst exciting is not the answer. Changing the structure might be, change the pay scheme of MP's so they get £20,000 a year it sounds unfair but at the moment the job only attracts people who want power and money so they are obviously going to twist it for their own benefit!

Also Green peace and UKIP focus too much on one area they need to expand their image if they are going to get any where near parliament.
I agree with most of your points but how can you change a corrupt structure to an appreciable level when the people who make the laws are the very ones who are corrupt in the first place?

Moreover i never said Iran was big and powerful, i think we can all agree an open mind is needed for this subject. I will do more research, what sources have you used to draw those conclusions? Its hard to find the real facts and i am clearly not knowledgeable enough on the subject, if Iran has suffered to such an extent from sactions that its not progressing at all in any social, infrastructural or economic facets then i really feel for the Iranian people.

Is Iran actually falling apart at the seams? or just progressing at a slower and slower rate? I only ask because i have spoken to Iranians recently that said their country was progressing, a good place and not what its been made out to be. They themselves are likely to be influenced by media etc so my evidence from a few Iranians and news sources doesnt seem to stand up very well. I will retract my comments.
Interestingly, the two Iranians I've heard the opinion of (both of whom have also lived outside of their country) have quite the opposite opinion to those you have spoken with. They're displeased with the structure of government, and though you're correct to say that Ahmadinejad isn't the monster he is made out to be in the US, he isn't really the main figure in the country either. It is far from being a progressive country particularly under such a government as it is now; progressive means more than simply becoming more technologically advanced, they still have distance to travel in terms of human rights and freedoms.

nb. This isn't to draw comparison between a particular western country either; I'm not disputing your gripes with western governments at all, quite the contrary.

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Re: Political rant

Post by Wot lad? » Tue Feb 28, 2012 9:28 pm

skalpel wrote:Interestingly, the two Iranians I've heard the opinion of (both of whom have also lived outside of their country) have quite the opposite opinion to those you have spoken with. They're displeased with the structure of government, and though you're correct to say that Ahmadinejad isn't the monster he is made out to be in the US, he isn't really the main figure in the country either. It is far from being a progressive country particularly under such a government as it is now; progressive means more than simply becoming more technologically advanced, they still have distance to travel in terms of human rights and freedoms.

nb. This isn't to draw comparison between a particular western country either; I'm not disputing your gripes with western governments at all, quite the contrary.
Its just a question of how deep the rabbit hole goes really, and i think it goes deeper than most people would even consider but thats just like my opinion man.

... <parrot>
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Re: Political rant

Post by skalpel » Tue Feb 28, 2012 10:05 pm

nom de plume wrote:
skalpel wrote:Interestingly, the two Iranians I've heard the opinion of (both of whom have also lived outside of their country) have quite the opposite opinion to those you have spoken with. They're displeased with the structure of government, and though you're correct to say that Ahmadinejad isn't the monster he is made out to be in the US, he isn't really the main figure in the country either. It is far from being a progressive country particularly under such a government as it is now; progressive means more than simply becoming more technologically advanced, they still have distance to travel in terms of human rights and freedoms.

nb. This isn't to draw comparison between a particular western country either; I'm not disputing your gripes with western governments at all, quite the contrary.
Its just a question of how deep the rabbit hole goes really, and i think it goes deeper than most people would even consider but thats just like my opinion man.

... <parrot>
Can you elaborate on this? I'm always keen on delving into this sort of mindset.

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Re: Political rant

Post by Wot lad? » Wed Feb 29, 2012 1:29 am

Almost everyone will accept our government is corrupt on some scale right?

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
My views are the same as George Carlin. Carlin is talking about America but the same applies for this country. The micro may differ on some details but the macro is the same.

This is a good video if you like to question
" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


I merely put two and two together, you dont need to watch any "conspiracy" videos or use flaky evidence, you can base all of it on fact. I merely take the next step and i am of the opinion that the entire system is designed to be run like a business for the interests of a few, irrespective of whether labour, lib dem or tories are in charge.

The city of london is a privately owned corporation, the Queen has to ask permission of the Lord Major to enter, it has its own courts, its own laws, its own flag and police force, its not part of England either or the commonwealth. It became a sovreign state in 1694 when King William III privatised the Bank of England.

Im open to all views on all matters within reason.
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