Man U v Newcastle

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Re: Man U v Newcastle

Post by Bodacious Benny » Sun Sep 12, 2021 10:35 am

Colly wrote:
Sun Sep 12, 2021 10:29 am
Only seen the MOTD highlights but we conceded some poor goals there. First two Woodman could have done better, and how Fernandes was given so much space for the third is beyond me. Lingard's goal was excellent but the others weren't dealt with well.

Couple of wasteful chances for us too, Joelinton could have had a couple if Willock and Longstaff were awake.
How many of our goals this season have been like that? A lot. Shows the coaching is poor and players aren’t switched on, this isn’t a rare occurrence.

Even if you look at Ings stunner for villa against us, one of the best finishers in the league left in acres of space in the box (think it was Schar on that occasion nowhere near him).
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Re: Man U v Newcastle

Post by krully » Sun Sep 12, 2021 1:26 pm

3 goals conceded in 4 games is shocking, especially when we're playing with 5 at the back...

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Re: Man U v Newcastle

Post by gola » Sun Sep 12, 2021 1:48 pm

lol true

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Re: Man U v Newcastle

Post by Bodacious Benny » Mon Sep 13, 2021 6:35 pm



Who put 50p in the d*******?
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Re: Man U v Newcastle

Post by Remember Colo » Mon Sep 13, 2021 6:57 pm

Bodacious Benny wrote:
Mon Sep 13, 2021 6:35 pm


Who put 50p in the d*******?
And among the many differences is that when Graham Potter eventually loses his job, he may never manage in the PL again. Steve Bruce has the same piss-poor results for over a decade and keeps getting another kick at the can. He's never done anything to receive the benefit of the doubt within the industry that he has.

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Re: Man U v Newcastle

Post by Bodacious Benny » Mon Sep 13, 2021 8:29 pm

Not a single thing has progressed under Bruce, Luke Edwards is a total bellend and should probably be writing for The Sun.
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Re: Man U v Newcastle

Post by Bodacious Benny » Mon Sep 13, 2021 9:05 pm

Listening to Townsend's post-match, saying Rafa doesn't praise you, he keeps wanting you to improve.

We've got Steve "we did ever so well and played fantastically" Bruce after every defeat. Wonder why standards have nose dived. Whether people liked Rafa or not, anyone who claims there's not much difference between him Bruce needs to book themselves into their local mental hospital for an evaluation ASAP.
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Re: Man U v Newcastle

Post by Cabella's Invincible Hair » Mon Sep 13, 2021 10:59 pm

Mate of mine is an Everton fan and unsurprisingly unsure about that particular appointment. Used take the piss out of me for banging on about him, even years after he left. Made a comment tonight about the way Benitez changed the game with tactics or something. I didn't see the match, so not sure exactly what he meant, but it's obviously something he did often in his time here. Wasn't much a fan of his style of play, but I really do miss that. Having someone steering the boat who actually knows how to steer really shouldn't be too much to ask.

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Re: Man U v Newcastle

Post by Bodacious Benny » Tue Sep 14, 2021 6:22 am

Cabella's Invincible Hair wrote:
Mon Sep 13, 2021 10:59 pm
Mate of mine is an Everton fan and unsurprisingly unsure about that particular appointment. Used take the piss out of me for banging on about him, even years after he left. Made a comment tonight about the way Benitez changed the game with tactics or something. I didn't see the match, so not sure exactly what he meant, but it's obviously something he did often in his time here. Wasn't much a fan of his style of play, but I really do miss that. Having someone steering the boat who actually knows how to steer really shouldn't be too much to ask.
We’ve got uncle Albert plotting our course <laugh>
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Re: Man U v Newcastle

Post by Oval85 » Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:49 am

Cabella's Invincible Hair wrote:
Mon Sep 13, 2021 10:59 pm
Mate of mine is an Everton fan and unsurprisingly unsure about that particular appointment. Used take the piss out of me for banging on about him, even years after he left. Made a comment tonight about the way Benitez changed the game with tactics or something. I didn't see the match, so not sure exactly what he meant, but it's obviously something he did often in his time here. Wasn't much a fan of his style of play, but I really do miss that. Having someone steering the boat who actually knows how to steer really shouldn't be too much to ask.
No need for steering wheel when you have a row-boat.

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Re: Man U v Newcastle

Post by Bodacious Benny » Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:50 am

Oval85 wrote:
Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:49 am
Cabella's Invincible Hair wrote:
Mon Sep 13, 2021 10:59 pm
Mate of mine is an Everton fan and unsurprisingly unsure about that particular appointment. Used take the piss out of me for banging on about him, even years after he left. Made a comment tonight about the way Benitez changed the game with tactics or something. I didn't see the match, so not sure exactly what he meant, but it's obviously something he did often in his time here. Wasn't much a fan of his style of play, but I really do miss that. Having someone steering the boat who actually knows how to steer really shouldn't be too much to ask.
No need for steering wheel when you have a row-boat.
<laugh> <applause>

Did actually make me laugh out load <laugh>
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Re: Man U v Newcastle

Post by Remember Colo » Tue Sep 14, 2021 3:15 pm

Bodacious Benny wrote:
Mon Sep 13, 2021 9:05 pm
Listening to Townsend's post-match, saying Rafa doesn't praise you, he keeps wanting you to improve.

We've got Steve "we did ever so well and played fantastically" Bruce after every defeat. Wonder why standards have nose dived. Whether people liked Rafa or not, anyone who claims there's not much difference between him Bruce needs to book themselves into their local mental hospital for an evaluation ASAP.
I definitely won't compare the two as managers. Both may feel most comfortable with conservative play, but one is exacting (sometimes to a fault), while one doesn't seem detail-oriented in the slightest. Specifically, one is incredibly demanding about the roles each player must fulfill, and how to fulfill them - and those not doing as he wants probably won't play much. And the other well, doesn't.

Though, I will say that what a manager says in the presser after has a lot more to do with how he wants to project and influence expectations on himself, and may not reflect what he says to the players behind closed doors or on the training pitch. So I wouldn't necessarily assume Bruce is actually praising players in private when it matters. Just as Rafa rarely roasted his players in post-match interviews - even though you knew he was probably giving them a bollocking in training.

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Re: Man U v Newcastle

Post by Bodacious Benny » Tue Sep 14, 2021 3:38 pm

Remember Colo wrote:
Tue Sep 14, 2021 3:15 pm
Bodacious Benny wrote:
Mon Sep 13, 2021 9:05 pm
Listening to Townsend's post-match, saying Rafa doesn't praise you, he keeps wanting you to improve.

We've got Steve "we did ever so well and played fantastically" Bruce after every defeat. Wonder why standards have nose dived. Whether people liked Rafa or not, anyone who claims there's not much difference between him Bruce needs to book themselves into their local mental hospital for an evaluation ASAP.
I definitely won't compare the two as managers. Both may feel most comfortable with conservative play, but one is exacting (sometimes to a fault), while one doesn't seem detail-oriented in the slightest. Specifically, one is incredibly demanding about the roles each player must fulfill, and how to fulfill them - and those not doing as he wants probably won't play much. And the other well, doesn't.

Though, I will say that what a manager says in the presser after has a lot more to do with how he wants to project and influence expectations on himself, and may not reflect what he says to the players behind closed doors or on the training pitch. So I wouldn't necessarily assume Bruce is actually praising players in private when it matters. Just as Rafa rarely roasted his players in post-match interviews - even though you knew he was probably giving them a bollocking in training.
Afternoon Colo <gent> How's work?

Yes there could well be an element of that, and I would imagine Rafa would happily bollock his players behind closed doors.

For Bruce it seems he hasn't had any coaching or thought in how to respond to the media. He's easily wound up and takes everything personally. I don't like Lee Ryder at all, but his question about whether Bruce went on holiday was a fair one as it is something a lot of fans had been wondering. Bruce took it as an outright personal attack, and his wording when talking about the fans and the paper being to blame for "what they're like" was incredibly poor judgement.

I do have some sympathy for Bruce as he's literally hung out to dry on the club by everything and it can't be a nice position to be in. Nobody else ever comes out to explain things, other than the occasional unnamed written statement. But a lot of fans frustrations he brings on himself in the way he speaks about the fans and their 'unrealistic expectations', the disorganised, chaotic approach to matches and his bizarre and every changing team selections. It's no wonder the players look clueless on the pitch.

Take Woodman. Young GK, new to the PL. He's played 4 league games, and in those games had 4 different combinations of defenders in front of him. It makes no sense at all. Yes he made mistakes against Man U, but with such disorganisation in front of him he doesn't stand a chance. Then Hayden. The game before last he was our most advanced midfielder (God only knows why), then last match he's at CB.

Manquillo. Not played a league game for ages then is put straight in at RWB away to Man U (who in fairness, he should be getting more game time as generally does well when he plays).

Joelinton. "NOT A STRIKER" says Bruce on repeat. Wilson is out injured, who does he play? Joelinton. What's Gayle done? He did well in pre-season, got a new three-year deal, not played in the PL this season! Just play him for a game or two, he'll sniff out more chances in the box.

Fraser, decent pre-season tbf to him. Got his fitness back, scored a goal or two. Where is he? Occasional 90th minute substitute appearance in CM...he's a winger! I could go on.

This turned into a rant <laugh>
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Re: Man U v Newcastle

Post by Oval85 » Tue Sep 14, 2021 5:17 pm

Bodacious Benny wrote:
Tue Sep 14, 2021 3:38 pm
Remember Colo wrote:
Tue Sep 14, 2021 3:15 pm

I definitely won't compare the two as managers. Both may feel most comfortable with conservative play, but one is exacting (sometimes to a fault), while one doesn't seem detail-oriented in the slightest. Specifically, one is incredibly demanding about the roles each player must fulfill, and how to fulfill them - and those not doing as he wants probably won't play much. And the other well, doesn't.

Though, I will say that what a manager says in the presser after has a lot more to do with how he wants to project and influence expectations on himself, and may not reflect what he says to the players behind closed doors or on the training pitch. So I wouldn't necessarily assume Bruce is actually praising players in private when it matters. Just as Rafa rarely roasted his players in post-match interviews - even though you knew he was probably giving them a bollocking in training.
Afternoon Colo <gent> How's work?

Yes there could well be an element of that, and I would imagine Rafa would happily bollock his players behind closed doors.

For Bruce it seems he hasn't had any coaching or thought in how to respond to the media. He's easily wound up and takes everything personally. I don't like Lee Ryder at all, but his question about whether Bruce went on holiday was a fair one as it is something a lot of fans had been wondering. Bruce took it as an outright personal attack, and his wording when talking about the fans and the paper being to blame for "what they're like" was incredibly poor judgement.

I do have some sympathy for Bruce as he's literally hung out to dry on the club by everything and it can't be a nice position to be in. Nobody else ever comes out to explain things, other than the occasional unnamed written statement. But a lot of fans frustrations he brings on himself in the way he speaks about the fans and their 'unrealistic expectations', the disorganised, chaotic approach to matches and his bizarre and every changing team selections. It's no wonder the players look clueless on the pitch.

Take Woodman. Young GK, new to the PL. He's played 4 league games, and in those games had 4 different combinations of defenders in front of him. It makes no sense at all. Yes he made mistakes against Man U, but with such disorganisation in front of him he doesn't stand a chance. Then Hayden. The game before last he was our most advanced midfielder (God only knows why), then last match he's at CB.

Manquillo. Not played a league game for ages then is put straight in at RWB away to Man U (who in fairness, he should be getting more game time as generally does well when he plays).

Joelinton. "NOT A STRIKER" says Bruce on repeat. Wilson is out injured, who does he play? Joelinton. What's Gayle done? He did well in pre-season, got a new three-year deal, not played in the PL this season! Just play him for a game or two, he'll sniff out more chances in the box.

Fraser, decent pre-season tbf to him. Got his fitness back, scored a goal or two. Where is he? Occasional 90th minute substitute appearance in CM...he's a winger! I could go on.

This turned into a rant <laugh>
It was a precise and well written rant though

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Re: Man U v Newcastle

Post by Remember Colo » Tue Sep 14, 2021 8:51 pm

Bodacious Benny wrote:
Tue Sep 14, 2021 3:38 pm
Remember Colo wrote:
Tue Sep 14, 2021 3:15 pm

I definitely won't compare the two as managers. Both may feel most comfortable with conservative play, but one is exacting (sometimes to a fault), while one doesn't seem detail-oriented in the slightest. Specifically, one is incredibly demanding about the roles each player must fulfill, and how to fulfill them - and those not doing as he wants probably won't play much. And the other well, doesn't.

Though, I will say that what a manager says in the presser after has a lot more to do with how he wants to project and influence expectations on himself, and may not reflect what he says to the players behind closed doors or on the training pitch. So I wouldn't necessarily assume Bruce is actually praising players in private when it matters. Just as Rafa rarely roasted his players in post-match interviews - even though you knew he was probably giving them a bollocking in training.
Afternoon Colo <gent> How's work?

Yes there could well be an element of that, and I would imagine Rafa would happily bollock his players behind closed doors.

For Bruce it seems he hasn't had any coaching or thought in how to respond to the media. He's easily wound up and takes everything personally. I don't like Lee Ryder at all, but his question about whether Bruce went on holiday was a fair one as it is something a lot of fans had been wondering. Bruce took it as an outright personal attack, and his wording when talking about the fans and the paper being to blame for "what they're like" was incredibly poor judgement.

I do have some sympathy for Bruce as he's literally hung out to dry on the club by everything and it can't be a nice position to be in. Nobody else ever comes out to explain things, other than the occasional unnamed written statement. But a lot of fans frustrations he brings on himself in the way he speaks about the fans and their 'unrealistic expectations', the disorganised, chaotic approach to matches and his bizarre and every changing team selections. It's no wonder the players look clueless on the pitch.

Take Woodman. Young GK, new to the PL. He's played 4 league games, and in those games had 4 different combinations of defenders in front of him. It makes no sense at all. Yes he made mistakes against Man U, but with such disorganisation in front of him he doesn't stand a chance. Then Hayden. The game before last he was our most advanced midfielder (God only knows why), then last match he's at CB.

Manquillo. Not played a league game for ages then is put straight in at RWB away to Man U (who in fairness, he should be getting more game time as generally does well when he plays).

Joelinton. "NOT A STRIKER" says Bruce on repeat. Wilson is out injured, who does he play? Joelinton. What's Gayle done? He did well in pre-season, got a new three-year deal, not played in the PL this season! Just play him for a game or two, he'll sniff out more chances in the box.

Fraser, decent pre-season tbf to him. Got his fitness back, scored a goal or two. Where is he? Occasional 90th minute substitute appearance in CM...he's a winger! I could go on.

This turned into a rant <laugh>
Completely agree. I think managers underestimate the unique stresses that come with managing a club that is so disfunctional in the front office, and the extra pressure that comes with being the face of it to a long-frustrated fanbase and media that has been kept at arm's length by the club for years. Subsequently as time goes on and their frustration in the job and the related performance builds, it comes out in outbursts like that which make them look even worse. The same happened to Pardew. Bruce just doesn't seem like a good communicator - full stop. Which is an important part of the managerial job, especially for a club that has phantoms working above him.

But you're also right that he's been hung out to dry. I think about how he was criticised since his hiring that unlike Rafa he was a patsy that would never criticise the club for not investing in the squad or facilities. And now when he does complain and say the very things fans are saying/thinking, he's criticised for being unprofessional and making excuses for his failings. So even though I think his coaching is often very questionable, from the fan perception standpoint, it's always going to be uphill battle.

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Re: Man U v Newcastle

Post by Bodacious Benny » Thu Sep 16, 2021 12:29 pm

Bruce quotes from the pre-Leeds press conference:

"Well then you start looking at yourself, of course but knowing the way I am, it’s not in my nature to walk away from something when we’re in a fight. ‘Oh it’s too difficult so I’m going to walk away’, that doesn’t really register with me.”

How many jobs has he walked away from?
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Re: Man U v Newcastle

Post by Remember Colo » Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:12 pm

Bodacious Benny wrote:
Thu Sep 16, 2021 12:29 pm
Bruce quotes from the pre-Leeds press conference:

"Well then you start looking at yourself, of course but knowing the way I am, it’s not in my nature to walk away from something when we’re in a fight. ‘Oh it’s too difficult so I’m going to walk away’, that doesn’t really register with me.”

How many jobs has he walked away from?
Difference is that he was walking away to what he perceived as better opportunities. He won't be finding a promotion when he sees the door with us.

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